Kirby Urner
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  • Portland, OR
  • United States
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Kirby Urner's Discussions

Regarding Pronouns

Started this discussion. Last reply by Kirby Urner 5th month 8. 3 Replies

I pay a lot of attention to pronoun use. People often say "our nuclear weapons" and/or "what we did in Vietnam". I don't have any nuclear weapons, nor do my friends.When I spend lots of time/energy…Continue

Memo on Facebook (RSoF page)

Started 4th month 19 0 Replies

I understand AFSC's support of BDS. However Quakers are super interested in the issue of forced conscription and the right of conscientious objection. A super logical alliance would be with orthodox…Continue

Theological Terms

Started 4th month 2 0 Replies

Portland is very Asian.  Some of the terms used in theology might need fine tuning if we're using them to classify beliefs.If I believe in reincarnation, that's life after death right?  This life is…Continue

No Quakers, Only Quakerism

Started this discussion. Last reply by Kirby Urner 3rd month 29. 5 Replies

I like Karen Armstrong's observation that Protestants especially are into "head beliefs". They believe a lot hinges on all that monkey chatter in their brains, about whether "God exists" or not, and…Continue

 

Kirby Urner's Page

Latest Activity

Kirby Urner commented on Kirby Urner's blog post 'Of Plain Speech & Post-nationalism'
"Given my Friendly testimony against outward weapons as a means to an end ("no way to peace, peace is the way" talk), it stands to reason I'd have a problem being a member of any "we" with nuke weapons. The pronoun…"
5th month 17
Kirby Urner posted a blog post

Of Plain Speech & Post-nationalism

I might bring this up informally with Oversight Committee, like I did with my "Gun Club" Stetson.  "Is this OK?" By "this" I mean my tendency to refer to nations in the past tense, as a matter of plain speaking, of telling the truth.  I know they're currently still fervently believed in by many people:  nationalism…See More
5th month 14
Kirby Urner commented on Kirby Urner's blog post 'Siding with Iran'
""What will the US do then? This is the crucial question for the Middle East and the rest of the world." (Counterpunch) BTW, I hardly ever say "the US" anymore as my perception is of a rogue district, DC, arrogating power in the…"
5th month 11
Forrest Curo commented on Kirby Urner's blog post 'Siding with Iran'
"I think this is one of those times when Dmitri Orlov's take makes more sense than not: http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2018/05/the-us-pulled-out-of-iran-nuclear-deal.html#more"
5th month 11
Forrest Curo commented on Kirby Urner's blog post 'Siding with Iran'
5th month 11
Kirby Urner posted a blog post

Siding with Iran

As my long time blog readers know, I don't believe the Persians are hellbent on getting nuclear weapons.  On the contrary, the political rhetoric coming from these religious leaders as that holding such WMDs is highly immoral and unethical. The US Christians don't usually say that.  Evangelicals tend to be pro atom bomb, as an expression of God's love for them. Protestants are especially bomb crazed and explosive ordnance, along with horror films, are principal exports of those infecting the…See More
5th month 10
Kirby Urner replied to Kirby Urner's discussion 'Regarding Pronouns'
"Really glad to have a state senator with strong military credentials standing up against the war in Syria. He'll be harder to dismiss as a "Russian bot". He makes it clear it's not the DoD, but the CIA/State Department getting…"
5th month 8
Kirby Urner posted a blog post

Excerpt from a Memo to SNEC (typos fixed, mentions Earlham)

[SNEC = Synergeticists of the Northeast Corridor ]Because I went to a fancy school (Princeton) and studied philosophy, I'm used to such as Dr. Walter Kaufman suggesting that "university philosophy" was a subject with zero backbone, a spineless trajectory for dweebs.  That was a challenge to us of course, to make it be otherwise. We were the new generation. He told me directly in his office he thought I was best of breed, in terms of my writing. Wittgenstein too begged his best students to get…See More
5th month 5
Mike Widney replied to Kirby Urner's discussion 'Regarding Pronouns'
"A truly tremendous statement. Thanks."
4th month 26
Madeleine Reidy replied to Kirby Urner's discussion 'Regarding Pronouns'
"I'm reminded of this quote from The Bothers Karamazov: "But when he knows that he is not only worse than all those in the world, but is also guilty before all people, on behalf of all and for all, for all human sins, the world's and…"
4th month 26
Elaine Caldwell Emmi liked Kirby Urner's discussion Regarding Pronouns
4th month 21
Barbara Harrison liked Kirby Urner's discussion Regarding Pronouns
4th month 21
Kirby Urner posted a discussion

Regarding Pronouns

I pay a lot of attention to pronoun use. People often say "our nuclear weapons" and/or "what we did in Vietnam". I don't have any nuclear weapons, nor do my friends.When I spend lots of time/energy fighting something, such as the invasion of Iraq, I don't then turn around and say "what we did in Iraq". I don't assume some mantle of guilt from others for their crimes. Right now, I'm a friend of Iran and I fight DC tooth and nail. I will never in future say "what we did to Syria" as if I had any…See More
4th month 20
Kirby Urner posted a discussion

Memo on Facebook (RSoF page)

I understand AFSC's support of BDS. However Quakers are super interested in the issue of forced conscription and the right of conscientious objection. A super logical alliance would be with orthodox Jews who do not wish to serve in the IDF on religious grounds.Does AFSC work with this group much? If not, why not? Might be because of divergent views on LGBTQ but then no one says alliances imply 100% agreement on all issues.Perhaps AFSC has approached True Torah Jews and been rebuffed? I suppose…See More
4th month 19
Keith Saylor liked Kirby Urner's blog post Memo re Syria
4th month 19
Kirby Urner posted a blog post

Memo re Syria

[memo to a listserv for faculty and Peace Corps vets, a couple typos fixed, I think I'll add this to Medium]I was pleased to see the militaries colluding to put on a fun show for the vicious masses, eager for fireworks. TV voyeurs love a great spectacle. Many are whining they want more. They want to "rubbleize" Damascus. "Please please please give us more violence".Choosing to attack supposed "chemical weapons facilities" was on paper reckless (if any toxic gases were really present), but clips…See More
4th month 18

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About Me
Facebook: thekirbster

Autobio: http://wikieducator.org/User:KirbyUrner/Autobio

Member of IT Committee, North Pacific Yearly Meeting
Website/Blog
http://4dsolutions.net
Twitter Page
http://twitter.com/4DsolutionsPDX

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Kirby Urner's Blog

Of Plain Speech & Post-nationalism

Posted on 5th mo. 14, 2018 at 3:00pm 1 Comment

Stetson + C6XTY

I might bring this up informally with Oversight Committee, like I did with my "Gun Club" Stetson.  "Is this OK?"



By "this" I mean my tendency to refer to nations in the past tense, as a matter of plain…
Continue

Siding with Iran

Posted on 5th mo. 10, 2018 at 1:47pm 3 Comments

As my long time blog readers know, I don't believe the Persians are hellbent on getting nuclear weapons.  On the contrary, the political rhetoric coming from these religious leaders as that holding such WMDs is highly immoral and unethical.



The US Christians don't usually say that.  Evangelicals tend to be pro atom bomb, as an expression of God's love for them.



Protestants are especially bomb crazed and explosive ordnance, along…
Continue

Excerpt from a Memo to SNEC (typos fixed, mentions Earlham)

Posted on 5th mo. 5, 2018 at 3:00pm 0 Comments

[SNEC = Synergeticists of the Northeast Corridor ]

Because I went to a fancy school (Princeton) and studied philosophy, I'm used to such as Dr. Walter Kaufman suggesting that "university philosophy" was a subject with zero backbone, a spineless trajectory for dweebs.  That was a challenge to us of course, to make it be otherwise. We were the new generation. He told me directly in his office he thought I was best of breed, in terms of my writing.



Wittgenstein too begged his…

Continue

Memo re Syria

Posted on 4th mo. 18, 2018 at 1:00am 0 Comments

[memo to a listserv for faculty and Peace Corps vets, a couple typos fixed, I think I'll add this to Medium]



I was pleased to see the militaries colluding to put on a fun show for the vicious masses, eager for fireworks. TV voyeurs love a great spectacle. Many are whining they want more. They want to "rubbleize" Damascus. "Please please please give us more violence".




Choosing to attack supposed…

Continue

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At 11:59pm on 3rd mo. 2, 2016, Keith Saylor said…

Hello Kirby,

While I agree with your sentiment to it is not about either/or.

For me, it is an issue of just being honest about the reality. There just are many people, by their own admission and not my characterization, whose conscious is anchored in and whose conscience is informed by outward forms generally speaking. These people make up the majority of people on this earth. There is also a smaller number of people on this earth whose conscious, generally speaking, is anchored in and whose conscience, generally speaking,  is informed by direct and unmediated inherent self-existence or Presence itself in itself without regard to outward practices, institutions, teachers, leaders, theologies, religions, etc. 

The very nature of the former is to break up into various outward "brands," as you say, while the later has no real issue with outward branding because they do not participate in that way of existence. They profess no outward marks, forms, or practices by which they themselves or others may know them as under the pale of direct and unmediated Presence itself in itself. It is the establishing of outward forms that nurture the manifestation of various brands. Those early Quakers, who followed Foxonian innovation, and eventually turned back again to established outward ways, practices, and traditions, nurtured the manifestation of the various brands that now make up the Quakerism of today that is anchored in and informed by outward forms. 

There has been those from the beginnings of the Children of Light, as there are today, who are not  stakeholders in the establishment and perpetuation of any outward religion, practice, tradition, politic, economy, institutions, etc. so that there is no occasion for branding or disunity amongst those gathered into and governed by direct and unmediated Spirit itself in itself.

Anarchy is the lack of governance. The Children of Light whose conscious is anchored in and whose conscience is informed by Presence know the direct and unmediated governance of the same Presence itself in itself. 

Thank you, Keith

At 9:22am on 3rd mo. 2, 2016, Keith Saylor said…

Hello Kirby,

Recently you wrote:

I'm a Wittgenstein student and don't buy that names point to things, even in the simple case. Words are tools and their use defines them, not some mysterious "pointing". "Language on the one hand, real object on the other" -- that's a simplification that only gets one entangled in confusions.

Mathematics is not metaphorical if it's not trying to be "about" anything beyond itself. Chess, the game, is not really a "metaphor" for a war either, or if it is, it's not a war like we've ever seen. Games have their own integrity. They don't need to be "metaphoric".

Note: Santa and Satan differ only by letter arrangement, like Dog and God.

Your words are compelling and I've spent much time with them. I appreciate your observation that "Games have their own integrity" and I agree. In the same way that equations, theologies, institutions, languages, etc. have their own integrity. The physical world has its own integrity. Ecosystems have their own integrity. Economies have their own integrity. Church frameworks have their own integrity. Idols or icons and similitudes have their own integrity. An idol certainly does not need to point to anything beyond itself and often does not. It has its own integrity. This is the reality of things for many people on this earth and I affirm the truth of it.

With that said, there are others on this earth who re-create (for example, participate in gaming or worship) in the very activity of living itself so that we do not engage in setting aside outward frameworks within which we go about re-creating or worshipping for that matter. While we acknowledge the existence of outward gaming and worship frameworks or platforms, we may not participate in them because we live in the activity of re-creating or worshipping itself in itself. Living in the activity of re-creating or worshipping in all moments and circumstance in daily life makes entering into an outwardly established gaming, economic, religious, worship, and political, platforms or frameworks unnecessary. As with many of the founding Quakers (not all), we do not participate in the establishment or setting aside of outward religious institutions and instrumentalities and practices because those outward forms are not relevant to our experience which is established Itself in itself. We participate in the activity of worship and re-creating in every moment of our lives. Our conscious is not anchored in and our conscience is not informed by outward gaming or worshipping frameworks. In the same way,  we do not set aside or participate holy-days because a conscious anchored in and a conscious informed in the activity of re-creating or worshipping itself in itself knows a life that is holy in all moments and circumstances. It is just not necessary to set aside outward special days and times of holiness or celebration; even as we acknowledge the "integrity" of those outward holy-days for many people even when those holy-days and the language of those holy-days are not metaphoric in any way.

Thanks you for your words.

Keith

At 6:03pm on 12th mo. 10, 2015, Forrest Curo said…

Yeah, it's a little backasswards how this works -- but then we don't end up with all the liter in the same place. I really agree about The Exam; I get Spot Quizzes instead. (I don't always like the way these turn out!)

I did a poem once abt:

'Practice the corpse pose;it will be on The Exam'

but then so are sunsets.

The trouble with "How effective were you as an activist?" is that Jesus would have flunked that one. So maybe it's not such a good question. At best (unless you died of being thumped by a cop) you'd still face a further question: "Yes, but what have you done for Me lately?"

At 5:09pm on 12th mo. 10, 2015, Forrest Curo said…

I'm liking your last rant over on Keith's piece (where it really is slightly off-topic, alas!)

But (begging the question of whether there is such a thing) I really can't see "How effective were you as an activist?" being among the questions on The Exam.

 
 
 

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5th month 18
Kirby Urner commented on Kirby Urner's blog post 'Of Plain Speech & Post-nationalism'
"Given my Friendly testimony against outward weapons as a means to an end ("no way to peace,…"
5th month 17
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